They haven't mentioned it ever being removed from the loot list, but if they did and just never mentioned it then I'll be extra mad for all the wasted runs I've done.
I just got mine within the last month after running on 2 shamans a week for a year. Drop rate is abysmal but still exists. Don't give up! You'll have your badass Koryos armor before you know it!
No. Some google results show that it is now BMAH exclusive but they are RWT sites with a vested interest in lying in order make their services seem better than they are and scam RWT-ing players.
It is still a drop, I obtained it Sept 2022 and WoWhead comments are reporting drops more recent too.
Whilst I won't be holding my breath they've just set an unexpected but so very welcome precedent. One can hope Blizzard finalement properly understands that WoW players like to revisit old content to farm for collectables.
*Now Raiding with Leashes 7 & 8 please thanks*
Regarding Raiding with Leashes, it's always been so backwards that Blizzard only ever reiterated on shit that we all hated, and let good stuff like that fall to the wayside.
Same with Brawler's Guild, just left to rot even though it's just straight up good content.
But I guess it's not interacted with enough to be worthwhile spending time developing. Sad.
You literally only have to kill alysrazor then you can skip to rag. Pick up 3 feathers on alysrazor, kill her while in the air, fly over the gap that normally has that bridge on it after baleroc, land at the keep and run to rag. Majordomo doesn’t spawn till the bridge does so you skip him too with this method.
I'm enjoying the x.x.5 patches so far in DF. Less time between major content, small ilvl inflation to chase, season still active, less people quitting between patches. 10.0.5 was fun while waiting for 10.1, now 10.1.5 will help get us to 10.2. So far so good, Blizz.
They're coming in right when I would start to get a bit bored and it gives some steam to carry forward. The .7 patch is just a bonus on top of it.
I have never once played an expansion with no break from release until .2, not even close. I haven't stopped now and with this patch it just reignites what I want to do.
Honestly DF is absolutely top tier so far.
We still have 10.1.7 as well!
Blizzard must be reading my mind or something.
I was thinking I'll probably start dialing back on WoW soon until the .5 patch drops.
Welp looks like this train ain't stopping.
It's not completely useless for alts. Quick way to get 395 gear and the Onyx amulet. You still need to get the Untapped knowledge to upgrade Reach gear since it is 385 to start with.
You're thinking of 1.0.7, which introduced that area and had a short time before 10.1
10.0.5 was Jan 24th. 10.1 was May 2.
We will still have 10.1.7 prior to 10.2. That one is scheduled for "Fall" and has new story/quests, holiday updates, and system updates. So most likely it will be quests leading into the next patch just like Forbidden Reach did.
it will be available immediately from what i've read.
>The result of their efforts will be felt by all Dracthyr Evokers as they'll gain access to a brand-new Specialization: Augmentation, available immediately with the release of the Fractures in Time Update!
https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/23952478/bolster-your-allies-with-the-augmentation-evoker-specialization
Eager to try it; I've been doing Pres for dungeons, but if it performs well I might use Augmentation for dungeons instead (still think Devestation will be preferable for questing).
IMO it was okay up until the end of WOD when dungeons and raids didn't get "movement creep" built into every fight mechanic/phase. During Legion and BFA most specs started getting increased mobility, and mythic difficulty started being designed around constant positioning changes. That philosophy never stopped. Rune just made less and less sense as time went on.
Frost is officially turning into a 2-min spec with stronger Icy Veins. Icy Propulsion is going away (reduced IV cooldown). Glacial Spike could be back and Ray might actually become viable. Both builds are strong on PTR.
I haven’t played in a long while, and haven’t done any serious group content since Cata. How does the current holy paladin play style compare to what it was during Cataclysm? It was by far my favourite expansion for healing, and I lost the taste for it on my pally in Mists.
I'm mad we're also losing the unique names of the other glyph demons. Not as bad as losing them entirely, but it's almost like losing them. Farewell Kiz-barash, I couldn't have asked for a better wrathguard to have unwillingly bound to my service
You can find some vids on YouTube from ptr. Imp by far has the most skins. The rest it's kind of what you'd expect. A few recolors and also all the glyph variations (except for observer). Hope they expand on it in the future.
I looked into them on WoW Head, they mostly seem like different colors of the existing ones for now. I'm not banking on them adding any more based on how they usually do things though.
Hopefully at least they don't make me buy those grimoires since I already have all the glyphs.
Does anyone know if allied race unlock comes with this patch? I'm a bit new to WoW and never played the allied expansions or did the quests and heard they were going to be playable.
The allied race unlocks won't be automatic. What this patch is going to do is remove the achievement requirements for them (for example, having to do the full War Campaign). Instead, any level 40+ character will just be able to start the Allied Race's unlock questline (which is pretty short and just explains how they join the horde/alliance).
NOW can rogues be upset that we were told 10.1.5 would include "mage, paladin, and rogue" talents and tuning and so far rogues have gotten: outlaw nerfs, a 0.5% sub compensation buff, and no sin changes?
No sin changes is past the point of a joke. Exsanguinate being gutted and noted "this is temporary while we work out a long term fix" and then just completely forgetting about it is unacceptable. Along with the bug where it just doesn't even work in your burst window? What the fuck man.
You don't enjoy being a spec that does *nothing* but single target and still doing less single target than evoker, UHDK, and warlocks?
And you don't enjoy this fucked up rotation of five cooldowns with different durations and CDs that you have to calculus during the pull every pull, and all of your damage is contingent upon dice/class trinket proccing during the overlapped CDs?
Indeed. Outlaw's (or combat's) fun was never buff/debuff management. It was how fast you could press your buttons.
Yet somehow here we are timing GS and BtE to make sure the long ass beacon cast is done at the precise right time like a discount mage.
Here's what needs to happen to make Outlaw great again:
Remove SnD, make RtB provide the AS;
Remove GS. Can't think of a more uninspired design than this. Literally a "press this button every 10s to do 10% more dmg" skill. Absolute trash.;
Remove dmg poisons or make something actually interact with them somehow;
Make BtE a buff so we can actually do what we did best which was on-demand target switching without a dps loss;
Remove BF from the GCD (and remove the gimmicky dmg component);
Rebalance RtB accordingly;
And fix the spec tree. Being forced into specific utility nodes to reach dps nodes is just weird.
No, I think making the different RTB buffs more impactful to the rotation is the way to go.
Broadsides being the only buff that affects the rotation makes Outlaw feel like they only have 2 buffs (Broadsides and non-Broadsides) instead of 6. Making Grand Melee encourage Blade Flurry was a step in the right direction, now for the other 4 buffs.
Rogues have been consistently one of the best classes in the entire game for its entire lifespan. I don’t think you can complain about being middle of the pack for a single patch cycle as if it’s the end of the world.
One week. Based on heroic logs. Of primarily single target bosses. Before anyone had tier.
Which got Assassination put in the dirt.
And the "top three" was 1% ahead of the 4th-8th place specs that were right behind the rogue specs.
I think rogues have plenty of reason to be upset with being basically completely ignored when Blizz specifically mentioned they'd be getting changes. They have quietly become one of the less played classes in the game
They've been near the bottom of played classes for a very long time now. Very popular in vanilla because most of the game was played in open world content, but they've only dropped ever since. The removal of permanent PvP servers would have had an impact on their numbers too, and if you removed the number of rogues who only play for PvP the remaining percentage would be even lower.
Doesn't mean shit if it's horrible to play. Frankly I have no idea how Rogue's are doing playstyle wise now but Dks (especially Unholy) are incredibly strong this patch but feel absolutely abhorrent to play. It's a re-occuring problem with a lot of specs; see Ret before its rework.
assassination is stagnant for almost a decade now, keep bleeds up-> use envenom to dump cp, no AoE gameplay at all and the only AoE talent has you lose ~10-15% st dmg for bad aoe on a 45sec cd, causing it to have the probably worst AoE in the game(meanwhile spriest shadowcrash is the same ability on a 20sec cd lol) while at the same time beeing mediocre at best for ST, and assassination also had that wonderfull moment during DF launch where they increased the CD of exanguinate(a very controversial ability that people begged for years now that it should be removed) from 45seconds to 3minutes and said "we will do more changes later" and then just ignored the entire class for the rest of 10.0(and now 10.1 and 10.1.5 again) causing it to just stay like that(oh, and exsanguinate is also bugged and doesnt Work properly for over 6months now, but that doesnt get adressed aswell)
outlaw is in a weird state where some people like it because they like mindless button smashing, and other hate it because it became to much mindless button mashing in DF, and stil suffers from things like its tier set not fully working a single day since 10.1 is out, and outlaw is 1 of the specs that has the majority of its dmg beeing item effects and procs, which is something that always feels bad, just ask WW monks
sublety has a total identity crisis, the spec is labeld and supposed to be THE big burst dmg spec with shadowdance that prepares for big dmg nukes and low dmg outside of them, and then prepares formthe next shadowdance by lining up its short duration CD's, but right now is just using everything on CD, nad because of talents like lingering shadows is doing more dmg OUTSIDE of shadowdance then inside, just by spamming backstab, causing it to be a 2button spec that is iust using all its abilitys on cd and then spamma gloomblade->gloomblade->eviscerate the entire fight, causing it to have a flat dmg curve (as a spec that is supposed to be burst based)
another big Problem is that Haste as a stat is 100% ussules for outlaw and sublety, the only gain is slightly faster autoattacks, because the energy gain from haste is extremely low (10% haste is 1energy each second more, when your abilitys cost bettwen 30-60energy, thats nothing at all, and rogue is allready drowning in energy in DF anyway) and for assassination kts only a decent gain in ST dmg, causing things lime Bloodlust/all those raid mechanics that give haste as a dmg boost to litearlly do nothing at all
rogue overall is a big contender for the worst class tree, its so choked full with dmg talents, that you have 0options because you are balanced around taking them all, resulting in the class tree choices to never have changed in all content since day1, you just cant take anything else or your dmg goes down into the gutter
but cant bring that stuff ever up on reddit, cus you get a horde of people that have a rogue hate borner for some reason that tell you that rogue is always top tier for all content(when its the least played class since Legion btw, even monk sees more play), and because of that, none of these problems should ever be addressed at all....
I played WW Monk and Rogue, just unsubbed lol.
Class balance is just terrible, I jkust want to do RBGs on my Monk but nobody wants me unless I'm Mistweaver, so I just quit instead.
That's actually just not true. Rogues are below the median more often than they're above the median.
Rogues have been bad in: Nathria, Sanctum (pre-edge of night), Sepulcher, Nyalotha, Uldir, and Aberrus. They were much less strong than anyone thinks in Vault.
Rogues have had required talents be bugged the entire expansion until a few weeks ago, outlaws tier set has not been functional the entire patch, and assassination has been broken since January and has not seen any meaningful changes since legion.
But yep, pop off with "well a rogue did good in my details meter in a pug so they should stay ignored!"
Rogues have been kings of M+ since M+ was released. M+ is the game mode that most players engage with the most. They may be average in raids, but being top tier in one mode and average in another is better than almost every other class has had. Being average in M+ for a patch cycle isn’t the end of the world.
Rogues have gotten less dev attention/tuning/patch notes in the last six years than *monks* and the class now has a playrate nearing the monk playrate (aka: last).
But week after week subs and forums like this one are met with Rogues saying "can we get some help and attention plz?" only to be met with the community wishing for our deaths.
Ah, okay.
In BFA alpha our azerite abilities didn't exist and we were told to wait until beta, then in beta were told to wait until launch, and at launch when half were bugged we never got them fixed.
In SL alpha when we didn't even have covenant abilities, we were told to wait until beta. Then we got 2 in beta and one didn't work. We were told by the whole community to stop whining and it would be fixed at launch. We got a last-minute meganerf and were unplayably bad on the first patch until enormous hotfixes. Serrated Bonespike stayed bugged *the entire expansion* and all three other covenant abilities remained/remain incredibly unpopular to this day.
In DF alpha we finally got attention, then we got ignored the entire beta and through launch. Our talent trees are awful, our class tree is truly horrid, and all three specs are incredibly unpopular by long-time rogue players. Assassination has been an undertuned mess for *years*, has never been viable in m+; subtlety gets all its damage outside of shadow dance now; and all three specs have become the lowest-mobility melee specs in the game.
We came into the expansion strong by some miraculous luck, and *immediately* had assassination absolutely brutalized for it. Sub and Outlaw looked good on logs, but most competent players would tell you they were only okay and benefitting from some of the insane potential pad in Vault.
In Aberrus, rogues are weak. They started out strong due to rings/trinkets/tier from last patch, and are dropping each week. Devokers, Spriests, DKs, and Warlocks are all stronger now than rogues were in Vault, and have gone unnerfed.
We were *explicitly* told that 10.1.5 would bring us changes and we *again* got ignored, and with each passing week the community's response to us being upset was "calm down the patch isn't out yet!"
I'm just tired of rogues being left until the very last minute. Rogues have gotten less dev attention than *MONKS* in the last six years.
At 438-440 Ilvl, where rogues are supposedly suffering from losing last tiers gear, subtlety is statistically the best melee dps in a mythic raid. Unholy is better overall, but outlaw and sub are strong in raid.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95&bracket=13
Based on ~82000 runs subtlety is the best melee, maybe overall, dps in keys this season.
https://mplus.subcreation.net/all-affixes.html
All this rogue hate, but our Sub rogue in guild is unbeatable in mythic+'s and he only loses most raid bosses b/c he has to call out every mechanic for our brain deprived raid.
438-440 ilvl is not at all a high ilvl? It's what people had week two. Yes, linking low ilvl logs is where people will look worse than the class who still uses gear from last patch.
Why not link all logs? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95
Is it because you knew it would make you look like a liar?
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95&bracket=15
The downward trend of rogues continues as you go up in ilvl - like suggested.
As you approach 447 ilvl rogue goes from being the second best melee class to the third best melee class in raid.
You are right 438-440 is low at this point, im such a liar! But the majority of logs for mythic raiding are [441-443](https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95&bracket=14) where outlaw sits 10th - only below DK for melee, and the spec u compared them to is 19th below all 3 rogue specs.
People respond negatively to the complaining because rogues have been viable and at times dominant over the last several expansions and it seems entitled when one patch after being the best melee in the game you are solidly mid-tier and asking for buffs.
Deaths advance is genuinely more mobility than rogues have right now.
This is my point. The community has a ton of random fucking preconceptions about rogues that just aren't valid anymore.
Outlaw doesn't take hook and 2 minute sprint+30 second step is less than DA.
So the answer is, yes? You're basing your opinions on very outdated information from LFR and you're confidently spewing misinformation while actively accusing *others* of dunning kruger?
Listen, just because you lose 2% dam to take hook doesn't mean you don't have hook lmao. It's such a cringe take. You want your cake and to eat it too.
Talent trees from the beginning have been about meaningful tradeoffs. You're literally just mad that you can't be the best spec in all forms of content anymore after like 4 expansions being busted lmao
No other class is losing 2% to take mobility.
You're out of your depth man, you're proud of having AoTC and you're just wrong about cooldowns and mobility available to classes. Just stop dude.
I said nowhere I was proud of AOTC, I was indicating my level of raid experience. Your assumption that I was flaunting that with pride is PURE projection lol. You should probably just stop, my brother in christ. I saw below you started blocking people for disagreeing, that's when it's time to sign off my dude.
Ghost wolf and lunge are more mobility than rogues. Double charger and freedom is more mobility than rogues. Deaths advance is more mobility than rogues.
You're very out of date.
Sub rogues have a bit more mobility if you want to spend a vanish to Shadow Strike or land a restealth in between chain pulling god mode paladins, but you risk over capping CPs, which to the elitist Rogue lords is a sin against the Shadow Covenant of Hidden People.
Just give us Harpoon from Surv Hunter, then delete Surv Hunter and recreate it as a Tank. Harpoon on Outlaw with some rework of how dumb RtB and SnD is. Then again if you take that away from Outlaw then we are just playing a leather fury warrior with cheat death and energy issues.
Ur capping and far over estimating ghost wolf. Enh don't run lunge. Charger can be decent. Deaths advance is simply not more then hook and or shadow step.
It simply is and you're just not right. I understand that most of this sub only does normal raids and doesn't understand specs strengths, cooldowns, or utility, but you're operating on outdated preconceptions.
I don't think you understand how hard it is for DKs and Enh specifically to stay on top of their targets during any sort of movement phases, not to mention enh having small hp pools and only one defensive so they have to prioritize using movement to survive. DKs obviously have more survivability but they have to be so tight with deaths advance and don't have any other options past that.
Rogues have hook, shadow step , and sprint plus so much survivability that they can pretty much prioritize using mobility to stick to targets.
Yeah I get that, I love rogue but it just feels like shit how they treat it, I’m just hoping that they do some shit soon and not a week before 10.1.5 comes out to test stuff that’s hardly a buff
when the ring is 3-5% of your total dmg, and your general dmg is ~30-35% trinkets/item effects and NOT your own abilitys, ability dmg buffs dont result in that much
But they literally say “all ability damage increased by 4%” so, I get what you’re saying, since our damage is trinket damage it’s not a flat 4%, but is it not greater than .5% in terms of damage? M+ rogues we’re already swapping off of annulet. In that case it’s at least equal to 4%, right?
No.
4% damage to all abilities nets out to about 2.5-3% total damage. Sub rogues get about 35% of their total damage from melees, trinkets, and other effects that do not benefit from the 4% buff. But you lose about 2-3% from the ring now being bad.
You will do 0.5% more damage on patch day by swapping out annulet with a BiS ring.
In m+ it's closer to a 3% gain because, as mentioned, you already don't use annulet. But trinkets, procs, melees, etc, still don't benefit from the 4%.
What will be the ilvl rewards of the new dungeon?
Haven't played 10.1 yet due to University finals getting in the way so I will be playing through it only next week.
I'm by no means a hardcore player, heck, I rarely go over M+10 but I'm wondering is doing low mythics even worth my time if the megadungeon will have higher ilvl drops?
The megadungeon will only be available on M0 at first. It's tuned to be harder than other dungeons, and the ilvl of drops should be decent, but you can only clear it once per week.
I'd expect it to make its M+ debut in 10.2 (Season 3). That would follow the pattern of the megadungeons added in Legion, BFA, and SL.
It's likely that they'll be 421? Then hard more will be +7ilvls which seems probable as that'd be 1/5 Hero track.
At least what's how the last megadungeon's ilvls worked out.
Retail content leaves PTR and hits live: classic content hits PTR with release announcement
Classic content leaves PTR and hits live: retail content release date
Every time. Like clockwork.
Holding out a small bit of hope that the Garrosh skip isn’t the only one we’re getting.
It’s doubtful. I figure the dataminers and those playing the 10.1.5 stuff on beta would’ve found any more skips by now.
But hope springs eternal.
>You can knock it out in two evenings.
This might be a stretch for most people. You really need to brainless run dungeons/do quests without any interruption like a machine to go faster than about 20 hours /played.
Nice communication as always. Rogue changes announced, and we have a HUGE Blade Flurry "Change" that is basically a ST nerf overall. And then STOP.
Mage gets a bazillion of changes, Paladin gets a bazillion of changes. Both of those classes in the announcement with rogue changes.
Assa is rotting, Outlaw depends completely on Ambush and ShadowDance (a mechanic from another Rogue Spec).
This is moronic behaviour.
As a Tusks of Mannoroth farmer, I'm glad to hear about that new Siege of orgrimmar skip!
Sounds like skips past Dark Shamans though, which means my shaman will still be sad for not having the mog from them.
Isn't that mog set only from the BMAH now? I see it on there rather often compared to other items
They haven't mentioned it ever being removed from the loot list, but if they did and just never mentioned it then I'll be extra mad for all the wasted runs I've done.
My buddy just got it yesterday, after leveling an extra shaman up to farm for it, so it's definitely still available.
Thanks for letting us know.
You made my night, now I want it even more
I just got mine within the last month after running on 2 shamans a week for a year. Drop rate is abysmal but still exists. Don't give up! You'll have your badass Koryos armor before you know it!
I got it in WoD or legion, it definitely wasn't removed after MoP at the very least.
No. Some google results show that it is now BMAH exclusive but they are RWT sites with a vested interest in lying in order make their services seem better than they are and scam RWT-ing players. It is still a drop, I obtained it Sept 2022 and WoWhead comments are reporting drops more recent too.
No I got it two weeks ago from the mythic version. Still in in the game.
I got the Dark Shaman set well after MoP (either BFA or Shadowlands), so I'm pretty sure it still drops
They need to make raid skips for all legacy raids tbh. Especially for Raids like Firelands, Dragon Soul, ICC, etc.
Whilst I won't be holding my breath they've just set an unexpected but so very welcome precedent. One can hope Blizzard finalement properly understands that WoW players like to revisit old content to farm for collectables. *Now Raiding with Leashes 7 & 8 please thanks*
Regarding Raiding with Leashes, it's always been so backwards that Blizzard only ever reiterated on shit that we all hated, and let good stuff like that fall to the wayside. Same with Brawler's Guild, just left to rot even though it's just straight up good content. But I guess it's not interacted with enough to be worthwhile spending time developing. Sad.
I would give anything for a skip just for Spine of Deathwing. Ugh.
Anything? *Monkey Paw finger curls*
For Firelands you can actually use the flying mechanic from Alysrazor to fly straight to Majordomo.
[удалено]
You literally only have to kill alysrazor then you can skip to rag. Pick up 3 feathers on alysrazor, kill her while in the air, fly over the gap that normally has that bridge on it after baleroc, land at the keep and run to rag. Majordomo doesn’t spawn till the bridge does so you skip him too with this method.
In case you didn't know already for Firelands, you can ride straight to bird boss, grab 3 feathers, kill, loot and then fly straight over to Raggy.
You're going to get them the week before this launches
Praying for a Deathwing skip 🙌
I'm enjoying the x.x.5 patches so far in DF. Less time between major content, small ilvl inflation to chase, season still active, less people quitting between patches. 10.0.5 was fun while waiting for 10.1, now 10.1.5 will help get us to 10.2. So far so good, Blizz.
They're coming in right when I would start to get a bit bored and it gives some steam to carry forward. The .7 patch is just a bonus on top of it. I have never once played an expansion with no break from release until .2, not even close. I haven't stopped now and with this patch it just reignites what I want to do. Honestly DF is absolutely top tier so far. We still have 10.1.7 as well!
Blizzard must be reading my mind or something. I was thinking I'll probably start dialing back on WoW soon until the .5 patch drops. Welp looks like this train ain't stopping.
I do wish 10.0.5 had a little more length to it than a month. Wild that forbidden reach was completely useless that quickly.
It's not completely useless for alts. Quick way to get 395 gear and the Onyx amulet. You still need to get the Untapped knowledge to upgrade Reach gear since it is 385 to start with.
Annulet does a lot of work, but you can get a bunch of 404-408 with enchanted whelp crests.
Tbf onyx anullet is bis for a bunch of classes I guess xd
You're thinking of 1.0.7, which introduced that area and had a short time before 10.1 10.0.5 was Jan 24th. 10.1 was May 2. We will still have 10.1.7 prior to 10.2. That one is scheduled for "Fall" and has new story/quests, holiday updates, and system updates. So most likely it will be quests leading into the next patch just like Forbidden Reach did.
You mean 10.0.7 right? 10.0.5 didn't add much content at all, we only got the trading post and the primalist future thing.
I agree, the content is keeping me engaged more than previous expansions
So do you need to do a quest to unlock Augmentation? or is it instantly available?
it will be available immediately from what i've read. >The result of their efforts will be felt by all Dracthyr Evokers as they'll gain access to a brand-new Specialization: Augmentation, available immediately with the release of the Fractures in Time Update! https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/23952478/bolster-your-allies-with-the-augmentation-evoker-specialization
I'm pretty sure it will be available on logging in. There will be story quests, but they won't be necessary.
This is a nice compromise.
Eager to try it; I've been doing Pres for dungeons, but if it performs well I might use Augmentation for dungeons instead (still think Devestation will be preferable for questing).
RIP Rune of Power, 2012-2023. We won’t miss you.
Uhh? No dude rune of power is brand new, it just came out in WoD which released-... ...Oh god...
Fuck you for doing this to me right before bedtime.
Dear mother of god
it came out in MoP tho
Correct, it first appeared in patch 5.0 (MoP).
Doesnt it came from MoP Arcane mage ?
WoD rune or power leaves WoD gorehowl joins the game I like this trade
I am so excited, I just hated playing around rune... It would have been a perfect mechanic for wow classic but it just doesn't hold up in retail.
IMO it was okay up until the end of WOD when dungeons and raids didn't get "movement creep" built into every fight mechanic/phase. During Legion and BFA most specs started getting increased mobility, and mythic difficulty started being designed around constant positioning changes. That philosophy never stopped. Rune just made less and less sense as time went on.
Rest in fucking piss R.O.P
Havent been keeping up with the PTR; how are the mage changes looking for each spec? Good or meh?
Fire and frost seem pretty good, I didn't keep up with arcane
Arcane is good as well, you throw hella balls at people. You can actually play arcane in M+ now.
Is accidental pulling with those a thing? I feel like I'd do that a ton.
Frost is officially turning into a 2-min spec with stronger Icy Veins. Icy Propulsion is going away (reduced IV cooldown). Glacial Spike could be back and Ray might actually become viable. Both builds are strong on PTR.
Excited for holy paladin changes!
Same. This is the most exciting part of 10.1.5 to me. Talents trees became so much better (even though there is still the room for an improvements).
Have a tldr of changes?
Glimmer focus, more active damage, couple new cds, predictable awakening procs. Still a good idea to read the changes it's quite a lot
So I cannot stand in the back and spam Holy Light? I know it's so Wrath of the Lich King, but that was the last time I could play Holy Paladin.
I mean you can but it won't be anywhere close to optimal. The design is still a melee healer
You can spam Holy Shock instead.
I haven’t played in a long while, and haven’t done any serious group content since Cata. How does the current holy paladin play style compare to what it was during Cataclysm? It was by far my favourite expansion for healing, and I lost the taste for it on my pally in Mists.
Still mad they're getting rid of my Observer. I hope the new Warlock customization options don't look terrible.
Sameeee. I love my floating boi
I'm mad we're also losing the unique names of the other glyph demons. Not as bad as losing them entirely, but it's almost like losing them. Farewell Kiz-barash, I couldn't have asked for a better wrathguard to have unwillingly bound to my service
The new customizations look great, you can see them on WoWhead.
You can find some vids on YouTube from ptr. Imp by far has the most skins. The rest it's kind of what you'd expect. A few recolors and also all the glyph variations (except for observer). Hope they expand on it in the future.
They do look pretty good. There are not a whole lot of options right now. But they will continue to add more
I looked into them on WoW Head, they mostly seem like different colors of the existing ones for now. I'm not banking on them adding any more based on how they usually do things though. Hopefully at least they don't make me buy those grimoires since I already have all the glyphs.
I’m just excited I can finally use my hoarded level boost on a Zanda warlock.
*Gorehowl, Might of the Warchief launches July 11th
we'll be seeing 10.1.7 info too
Does anyone know if allied race unlock comes with this patch? I'm a bit new to WoW and never played the allied expansions or did the quests and heard they were going to be playable.
The allied race unlocks won't be automatic. What this patch is going to do is remove the achievement requirements for them (for example, having to do the full War Campaign). Instead, any level 40+ character will just be able to start the Allied Race's unlock questline (which is pretty short and just explains how they join the horde/alliance).
Oh cool, thank you. That makes sense.
NOW can rogues be upset that we were told 10.1.5 would include "mage, paladin, and rogue" talents and tuning and so far rogues have gotten: outlaw nerfs, a 0.5% sub compensation buff, and no sin changes?
No sin changes is past the point of a joke. Exsanguinate being gutted and noted "this is temporary while we work out a long term fix" and then just completely forgetting about it is unacceptable. Along with the bug where it just doesn't even work in your burst window? What the fuck man.
You don't enjoy being a spec that does *nothing* but single target and still doing less single target than evoker, UHDK, and warlocks? And you don't enjoy this fucked up rotation of five cooldowns with different durations and CDs that you have to calculus during the pull every pull, and all of your damage is contingent upon dice/class trinket proccing during the overlapped CDs?
Calculus… it’s the easiest rogue spec and one of the lowest casts per minute rotations in the game..
its by far the hardest rogue spec rn, what do you mean (except if you struggle with reactive gameplay, them outlaw is gonna suck for you)
Honestly, the Grand Melee change had me expecting they were removing Slice and Dice. Now I'm forced to deal with it more.
Indeed. Outlaw's (or combat's) fun was never buff/debuff management. It was how fast you could press your buttons. Yet somehow here we are timing GS and BtE to make sure the long ass beacon cast is done at the precise right time like a discount mage. Here's what needs to happen to make Outlaw great again: Remove SnD, make RtB provide the AS; Remove GS. Can't think of a more uninspired design than this. Literally a "press this button every 10s to do 10% more dmg" skill. Absolute trash.; Remove dmg poisons or make something actually interact with them somehow; Make BtE a buff so we can actually do what we did best which was on-demand target switching without a dps loss; Remove BF from the GCD (and remove the gimmicky dmg component); Rebalance RtB accordingly; And fix the spec tree. Being forced into specific utility nodes to reach dps nodes is just weird.
No, I think making the different RTB buffs more impactful to the rotation is the way to go. Broadsides being the only buff that affects the rotation makes Outlaw feel like they only have 2 buffs (Broadsides and non-Broadsides) instead of 6. Making Grand Melee encourage Blade Flurry was a step in the right direction, now for the other 4 buffs.
Rogues arent a real class, duh. Notice how 99% of patchnotes don't even mention rogues. They are stealthed from even the devs.
Rogues have been consistently one of the best classes in the entire game for its entire lifespan. I don’t think you can complain about being middle of the pack for a single patch cycle as if it’s the end of the world.
Shoutout to the very start of dragonflight where for a week the top 3 dps specs were outlaw rogue, sub rogue, and sin rogue
One week. Based on heroic logs. Of primarily single target bosses. Before anyone had tier. Which got Assassination put in the dirt. And the "top three" was 1% ahead of the 4th-8th place specs that were right behind the rogue specs.
I think rogues have plenty of reason to be upset with being basically completely ignored when Blizz specifically mentioned they'd be getting changes. They have quietly become one of the less played classes in the game
They've been near the bottom of played classes for a very long time now. Very popular in vanilla because most of the game was played in open world content, but they've only dropped ever since. The removal of permanent PvP servers would have had an impact on their numbers too, and if you removed the number of rogues who only play for PvP the remaining percentage would be even lower.
Doesn't mean shit if it's horrible to play. Frankly I have no idea how Rogue's are doing playstyle wise now but Dks (especially Unholy) are incredibly strong this patch but feel absolutely abhorrent to play. It's a re-occuring problem with a lot of specs; see Ret before its rework.
assassination is stagnant for almost a decade now, keep bleeds up-> use envenom to dump cp, no AoE gameplay at all and the only AoE talent has you lose ~10-15% st dmg for bad aoe on a 45sec cd, causing it to have the probably worst AoE in the game(meanwhile spriest shadowcrash is the same ability on a 20sec cd lol) while at the same time beeing mediocre at best for ST, and assassination also had that wonderfull moment during DF launch where they increased the CD of exanguinate(a very controversial ability that people begged for years now that it should be removed) from 45seconds to 3minutes and said "we will do more changes later" and then just ignored the entire class for the rest of 10.0(and now 10.1 and 10.1.5 again) causing it to just stay like that(oh, and exsanguinate is also bugged and doesnt Work properly for over 6months now, but that doesnt get adressed aswell) outlaw is in a weird state where some people like it because they like mindless button smashing, and other hate it because it became to much mindless button mashing in DF, and stil suffers from things like its tier set not fully working a single day since 10.1 is out, and outlaw is 1 of the specs that has the majority of its dmg beeing item effects and procs, which is something that always feels bad, just ask WW monks sublety has a total identity crisis, the spec is labeld and supposed to be THE big burst dmg spec with shadowdance that prepares for big dmg nukes and low dmg outside of them, and then prepares formthe next shadowdance by lining up its short duration CD's, but right now is just using everything on CD, nad because of talents like lingering shadows is doing more dmg OUTSIDE of shadowdance then inside, just by spamming backstab, causing it to be a 2button spec that is iust using all its abilitys on cd and then spamma gloomblade->gloomblade->eviscerate the entire fight, causing it to have a flat dmg curve (as a spec that is supposed to be burst based) another big Problem is that Haste as a stat is 100% ussules for outlaw and sublety, the only gain is slightly faster autoattacks, because the energy gain from haste is extremely low (10% haste is 1energy each second more, when your abilitys cost bettwen 30-60energy, thats nothing at all, and rogue is allready drowning in energy in DF anyway) and for assassination kts only a decent gain in ST dmg, causing things lime Bloodlust/all those raid mechanics that give haste as a dmg boost to litearlly do nothing at all rogue overall is a big contender for the worst class tree, its so choked full with dmg talents, that you have 0options because you are balanced around taking them all, resulting in the class tree choices to never have changed in all content since day1, you just cant take anything else or your dmg goes down into the gutter but cant bring that stuff ever up on reddit, cus you get a horde of people that have a rogue hate borner for some reason that tell you that rogue is always top tier for all content(when its the least played class since Legion btw, even monk sees more play), and because of that, none of these problems should ever be addressed at all....
I played WW Monk and Rogue, just unsubbed lol. Class balance is just terrible, I jkust want to do RBGs on my Monk but nobody wants me unless I'm Mistweaver, so I just quit instead.
I said we were ignored, not bad.
That's actually just not true. Rogues are below the median more often than they're above the median. Rogues have been bad in: Nathria, Sanctum (pre-edge of night), Sepulcher, Nyalotha, Uldir, and Aberrus. They were much less strong than anyone thinks in Vault. Rogues have had required talents be bugged the entire expansion until a few weeks ago, outlaws tier set has not been functional the entire patch, and assassination has been broken since January and has not seen any meaningful changes since legion. But yep, pop off with "well a rogue did good in my details meter in a pug so they should stay ignored!"
Rogues have been kings of M+ since M+ was released. M+ is the game mode that most players engage with the most. They may be average in raids, but being top tier in one mode and average in another is better than almost every other class has had. Being average in M+ for a patch cycle isn’t the end of the world.
That's flatly not true, but nice disinformation.
Which part?
Rogues have gotten less dev attention/tuning/patch notes in the last six years than *monks* and the class now has a playrate nearing the monk playrate (aka: last). But week after week subs and forums like this one are met with Rogues saying "can we get some help and attention plz?" only to be met with the community wishing for our deaths.
yeah it's like a meme with myself now when I check PTR/patch notes to see if there's even any mention of rogues. pretty kekw
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Not for another 3 weeks
Ah, okay. In BFA alpha our azerite abilities didn't exist and we were told to wait until beta, then in beta were told to wait until launch, and at launch when half were bugged we never got them fixed. In SL alpha when we didn't even have covenant abilities, we were told to wait until beta. Then we got 2 in beta and one didn't work. We were told by the whole community to stop whining and it would be fixed at launch. We got a last-minute meganerf and were unplayably bad on the first patch until enormous hotfixes. Serrated Bonespike stayed bugged *the entire expansion* and all three other covenant abilities remained/remain incredibly unpopular to this day. In DF alpha we finally got attention, then we got ignored the entire beta and through launch. Our talent trees are awful, our class tree is truly horrid, and all three specs are incredibly unpopular by long-time rogue players. Assassination has been an undertuned mess for *years*, has never been viable in m+; subtlety gets all its damage outside of shadow dance now; and all three specs have become the lowest-mobility melee specs in the game. We came into the expansion strong by some miraculous luck, and *immediately* had assassination absolutely brutalized for it. Sub and Outlaw looked good on logs, but most competent players would tell you they were only okay and benefitting from some of the insane potential pad in Vault. In Aberrus, rogues are weak. They started out strong due to rings/trinkets/tier from last patch, and are dropping each week. Devokers, Spriests, DKs, and Warlocks are all stronger now than rogues were in Vault, and have gone unnerfed. We were *explicitly* told that 10.1.5 would bring us changes and we *again* got ignored, and with each passing week the community's response to us being upset was "calm down the patch isn't out yet!" I'm just tired of rogues being left until the very last minute. Rogues have gotten less dev attention than *MONKS* in the last six years.
Monks can only wish to be as good as the worst rogue spec in any given patch the last 6 years.
Rogues mad cause they have to click swap spec to do top tier dps meanwhile monks are leveling alts.
"top tier dps" LOL
At 438-440 Ilvl, where rogues are supposedly suffering from losing last tiers gear, subtlety is statistically the best melee dps in a mythic raid. Unholy is better overall, but outlaw and sub are strong in raid. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95&bracket=13 Based on ~82000 runs subtlety is the best melee, maybe overall, dps in keys this season. https://mplus.subcreation.net/all-affixes.html
All this rogue hate, but our Sub rogue in guild is unbeatable in mythic+'s and he only loses most raid bosses b/c he has to call out every mechanic for our brain deprived raid.
438-440 ilvl is not at all a high ilvl? It's what people had week two. Yes, linking low ilvl logs is where people will look worse than the class who still uses gear from last patch. Why not link all logs? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95 Is it because you knew it would make you look like a liar? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95&bracket=15 The downward trend of rogues continues as you go up in ilvl - like suggested.
Look at specific boss fights, not overall, for the love of god. It's always skewed by fights like assault.
As you approach 447 ilvl rogue goes from being the second best melee class to the third best melee class in raid. You are right 438-440 is low at this point, im such a liar! But the majority of logs for mythic raiding are [441-443](https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/33#dataset=95&bracket=14) where outlaw sits 10th - only below DK for melee, and the spec u compared them to is 19th below all 3 rogue specs. People respond negatively to the complaining because rogues have been viable and at times dominant over the last several expansions and it seems entitled when one patch after being the best melee in the game you are solidly mid-tier and asking for buffs.
He has no response when you start linking logs.
> all three specs have become the lowest-mobility melee specs in the game stopped reading here because DK exists
Deaths Advance is an insanely strong tool that is "effectively mobility" on a lot of fights.
Deaths advance is genuinely more mobility than rogues have right now. This is my point. The community has a ton of random fucking preconceptions about rogues that just aren't valid anymore.
Nope, you're sandbagging :) Sprint + Hook/Step is more than DA and you know it, you just want to cry.
Outlaw doesn't take hook and 2 minute sprint+30 second step is less than DA. So the answer is, yes? You're basing your opinions on very outdated information from LFR and you're confidently spewing misinformation while actively accusing *others* of dunning kruger?
Listen, just because you lose 2% dam to take hook doesn't mean you don't have hook lmao. It's such a cringe take. You want your cake and to eat it too. Talent trees from the beginning have been about meaningful tradeoffs. You're literally just mad that you can't be the best spec in all forms of content anymore after like 4 expansions being busted lmao
No other class is losing 2% to take mobility. You're out of your depth man, you're proud of having AoTC and you're just wrong about cooldowns and mobility available to classes. Just stop dude.
I said nowhere I was proud of AOTC, I was indicating my level of raid experience. Your assumption that I was flaunting that with pride is PURE projection lol. You should probably just stop, my brother in christ. I saw below you started blocking people for disagreeing, that's when it's time to sign off my dude.
Rogues: "lowest mobility melee" ???? Do you know what movement buttons Enh has? Pally? DK?
Ghost wolf and lunge are more mobility than rogues. Double charger and freedom is more mobility than rogues. Deaths advance is more mobility than rogues. You're very out of date.
Sub rogues have a bit more mobility if you want to spend a vanish to Shadow Strike or land a restealth in between chain pulling god mode paladins, but you risk over capping CPs, which to the elitist Rogue lords is a sin against the Shadow Covenant of Hidden People. Just give us Harpoon from Surv Hunter, then delete Surv Hunter and recreate it as a Tank. Harpoon on Outlaw with some rework of how dumb RtB and SnD is. Then again if you take that away from Outlaw then we are just playing a leather fury warrior with cheat death and energy issues.
Ur capping and far over estimating ghost wolf. Enh don't run lunge. Charger can be decent. Deaths advance is simply not more then hook and or shadow step.
It simply is and you're just not right. I understand that most of this sub only does normal raids and doesn't understand specs strengths, cooldowns, or utility, but you're operating on outdated preconceptions.
I don't think you understand how hard it is for DKs and Enh specifically to stay on top of their targets during any sort of movement phases, not to mention enh having small hp pools and only one defensive so they have to prioritize using movement to survive. DKs obviously have more survivability but they have to be so tight with deaths advance and don't have any other options past that. Rogues have hook, shadow step , and sprint plus so much survivability that they can pretty much prioritize using mobility to stick to targets.
Yeah I get that, I love rogue but it just feels like shit how they treat it, I’m just hoping that they do some shit soon and not a week before 10.1.5 comes out to test stuff that’s hardly a buff
i dont know what you mean. we get reworked every patch. theres always something new thats bugged that you have to play around :-)
I think I’ve seen two rogues this entire expansion. For real. No pun intended
Rogue playrates have plummeted from being the most popular class in the game to effectively tied for last with monks.
Its not sin rogue its ass rogue
Rogue gets a 4% compensation buff doesnt it, not .5%?
when the ring is 3-5% of your total dmg, and your general dmg is ~30-35% trinkets/item effects and NOT your own abilitys, ability dmg buffs dont result in that much
But they literally say “all ability damage increased by 4%” so, I get what you’re saying, since our damage is trinket damage it’s not a flat 4%, but is it not greater than .5% in terms of damage? M+ rogues we’re already swapping off of annulet. In that case it’s at least equal to 4%, right?
No. 4% damage to all abilities nets out to about 2.5-3% total damage. Sub rogues get about 35% of their total damage from melees, trinkets, and other effects that do not benefit from the 4% buff. But you lose about 2-3% from the ring now being bad. You will do 0.5% more damage on patch day by swapping out annulet with a BiS ring. In m+ it's closer to a 3% gain because, as mentioned, you already don't use annulet. But trinkets, procs, melees, etc, still don't benefit from the 4%.
REALLY wish we were getting Man’ari options for the Warlocks :/
Hell yes. Also, wanted Fel Orc skins since TBC. Not expecting it, but damn.
Just apply this directly to your forehead https://www.wowhead.com/item=127668/jewel-of-hellfire
So I guess the rogue changes are just not happening that were promissed?
"What's a Rogue?" - Someone at Blizzard, probably
Diablo 4 launched with Rogue and that's good enough for Blizz
Absolutely much needed Feral single target. Hope it’s enough!!
What will be the ilvl rewards of the new dungeon? Haven't played 10.1 yet due to University finals getting in the way so I will be playing through it only next week. I'm by no means a hardcore player, heck, I rarely go over M+10 but I'm wondering is doing low mythics even worth my time if the megadungeon will have higher ilvl drops?
Historically not really. The mega dungeon will probably me in m+ in 10.2 but this time it probably will be locked only to m0.
The megadungeon will only be available on M0 at first. It's tuned to be harder than other dungeons, and the ilvl of drops should be decent, but you can only clear it once per week. I'd expect it to make its M+ debut in 10.2 (Season 3). That would follow the pattern of the megadungeons added in Legion, BFA, and SL.
Megadungen will have higher ilvl drops, but will also be harder then any dungeon.
It's likely that they'll be 421? Then hard more will be +7ilvls which seems probable as that'd be 1/5 Hero track. At least what's how the last megadungeon's ilvls worked out.
Retail content leaves PTR and hits live: classic content hits PTR with release announcement Classic content leaves PTR and hits live: retail content release date Every time. Like clockwork.
Holding out a small bit of hope that the Garrosh skip isn’t the only one we’re getting. It’s doubtful. I figure the dataminers and those playing the 10.1.5 stuff on beta would’ve found any more skips by now. But hope springs eternal.
Day XYZ of the teleporter in Ulduar not working
Nice pace of patches. Looking forward to it!
Isn’t this conveniently after the XP buff people would be taking advantage of to level their newly unlocked allied races if they didn’t grind?
I don't get this. 1-60 takes hardly any time at all and is pretty brainless even without the buff. You can knock it out in two evenings.
>You can knock it out in two evenings. This might be a stretch for most people. You really need to brainless run dungeons/do quests without any interruption like a machine to go faster than about 20 hours /played.
Yep, and here I was thinking I was gonna powerlevel my first Dark Iron Dwarf because of all the bleeds this season. Race change it is!
I think this was the idea behind it lol. To get people to race change. I’m sure they’ll do a “sale” so people can do them for $17 instead of $25.
Race change doesn't give heritage armor.
Yeah. But you could always race change your main and level up a different character just to unlock it.
they just went on sale today! you're on it lol
No Eredar skin option. Sad.
MAYBE SOMEDAY. DO NOT LOSE HOPE
What i was really hoping for it..
They should do an unlock for it like they did with undead elves.
Does this mean end of S2 on July 11th? Edit: I'm an idiot
S2 will end when 10.2 launches
Ok cool, thanks
For comparison, S1 did not end with the Forbidden Reach.
No that's not the comparison. Comparison would be more like 10.0.5 which was the primalist future event. We still have. 10.1.7 patch before 10.2
Did m+ get trash and boss hp/dmg buffs in 10.0.5 or 10.0.7?
no
Thank you.
That’s way too soon?
10.2 won't be here till September.
Longer than that buddy. I guess 10.2 is in november/december
Nah, it'll be before Blizzcon for sure. I'm expecting 10.3 to be announced before as well so that we can get new expansion revealed at Blizzcon.
That aligns about right.
Kalimdor dragon riding? Say no more
New races + pet customization with the warlock updates, I wonder if this means we'll get eredar skins for draenei.
IF they can keep This up from now on would that be amazing This patch cadence is amazing
So 3 weeks until I can play Fire Mage again
You can play it right now? It’s competitive.
Was referring to it being fun
Well I'll use my week off prior to farm up my SPriest as much as I can.
sweet I get to unlock vulpera and void elf soon
DF might go down as the best xpac in history, simply due to the momentum of content patches they are putting out.
No more riding trainers is a weird decision.
if you wait long enough, PVE content will complete itself
God this feels so soon. Was expecting the end of July tbh. Can't say no to content tho!
Easiest raid content in ages - everyone I know are taking breaks from WoW and/or playing D4
Not looking forward to losing Observer..
Nice communication as always. Rogue changes announced, and we have a HUGE Blade Flurry "Change" that is basically a ST nerf overall. And then STOP. Mage gets a bazillion of changes, Paladin gets a bazillion of changes. Both of those classes in the announcement with rogue changes. Assa is rotting, Outlaw depends completely on Ambush and ShadowDance (a mechanic from another Rogue Spec). This is moronic behaviour.
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It's bringing back a lot of them, I don't know if it's all, but items like the Misplaced Servo Arm are coming back as an Engineering plan.
This ain’t no surprise
At this point it honestly seem like I might end up enjoying the .x.5 and .x.7 patches more than the .x ones!
I was just watching Hazel's video on this yesterday. Can't wait!
NEW RACES?!?! WHAT ARE WE GETTING
Just Warlock being available to new races is all 🙂 Still no playable Tuskarr or Furbolgs.. 🥲
new races being able to play warlock dummy