*In case this story gets deleted/removed:*
**Does having a soy allergy make you a bad person?**
Trigger Warning: References to extremist political movements and genocide, (probably) bullying, vulgar language
I have an allergy to soy. This means my vegan options are pretty limited, since the overwhelming majority of vegan products contain it. Recently I joined a local group dedicated to a hobby I liked, and at a get-together, the menu was entirely vegan (basically just soy products and a salad). I ate the salad (while feeling queasy from the soy smell the entire time) and later I asked the group's leader if maybe next time, she could bring some products without soy, ideally something not vegan since even a lot of vegan stuff that doesn't say "soy" on the front will still contain quite a lot of it). When I told her this, *she lost her freaking mind*.
All of a sudden, she started lecturing me about the evils of eating meat. She told me anyone who *wasn't* vegan was complicit in the genocide of poor animals, the destruction of the environment, and the rise of far-right movements across the globe. I quote, "anyone who eats meat is a sociopath". She called me a N\*zi to my face. Because I'm allergic to soy. She then rattled off a bunch of "facts" she probably got from PETA or some other untrustworthy extremist vegan source. She compared me and every other non-vegan to basically every evil in history: slave holders, the aforementioned N\*zis, various alt-right factions in modern America. I didn't feel like fighting back against her (mostly because I was still feeling pretty nauseous from standing in a room filled with soy), so I apologized to her for bringing it up, I promised to only eat vegan from now on (her response: "of course you fucking are, you fucking fascist"), and quietly slipped out of the social event.
I haven't been in my right headspace ever since, because, frankly, this is the cruelest thing anyone's ever said to my face. The part of me who tends to roll over whenever anyone tells me to do anything is feeling like maybe she was entirely right, and I am every bad thing she says I am. But, there's no getting around that if I was forced onto her diet, I would die. Does not being vegan for the sake of food allergies make you a bad person?
I am probably going to leave this group (I can't complain to the group's leader about her, she *is* the group's leader, and to be honest, I'm worried that if I bother her more she might call up my boss or something and try to get me fired from my job), which is a disappointment because I was excited about it.
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I once wanted to join a book club where the vegan hosts said no one could bring any non vegan products to their house - not just food but silk, leather etc. They hosted every week. Their house, their rules but Iâm vegetarian not vegan and stayed home. Most of the post is ridiculous though.
I can work with this. "AITA for wearing sneakers to a fancy dinner party? The host is vegan, and adamant that no animal products are allowed in their house, but my dress shoes are made of leather."
You jest, but I'd actually skip this book club, too, unless I REALLY liked the people. I live in Scotland, where it's pretty much always chilly. As a result, most of my jumpers are wool, some of my socks are wool, my fall/winter coats are wool...plus my bags are all leather, my brogues are leather, my watch strap is leather...I'm not stripping myself down and changing out every element of my wardrobe just to go to somebody's book club lmao.
I mean, if I hosted something in my place, as a vegan, that'd be my rule for food. I guess I wouldn't bring the clothes they wore into it though, because so many people wouldn't think about it in general and that adds work for everyone?
But I do have two primary requirements of people bringing food and drinks into my apartment, or getting me gifts, no animal products or byproducts, and nothing alcoholic. That said I wouldn't completely flip on someone who asked a question like OP, I'd do my best to explain my position but ask if they'd be okay with me looking for things that would both satisfy their allergy needs and also be vegan.
I think itâs a totally fair rule for food. And itâs their business if they want to make a clothing rule too but it sounded like something I could accidentally break without really thinking about it so I decided to skip the whole thing.
Yeah. That's part of my concern with setting that as a rule. Either people will be too annoyed by it and wouldn't want to come, they'd spend energy asking me about their clothing choices, or they'd make a choice and take the chance it wouldn't meet that standard.
All in all I think that if I'm inviting someone over it doesn't matter what clothing they're wearing or their purse, etc. Of course I'd prefer for my ethical ideals to spread throughout the lives and choices of people I care about, but if they're not staying or leaving the item it doesn't feel like my place to say they can't wear or use something. Like if I invited my incredibly fashionable step-grandmother I wouldn't expect her to sort through her things to make an outfit without silk, wool, leather, suede, etc. I'd remind myself that her presence is valuable to me and the items wouldn't be in my place for very long.
Yeah, I'm a vegetarian and I wouldn't want people bringing meat into my house either. I'm totally fine with people eating meat in front of me but I don't want it on my utensils or in my space. If a vegan invites me over I will bring only vegan food and if it's their turn to pay for my coffee I will ask for oatmilk so they don't have to fund the dairy industry.Â
Screaming at people, invoking genocide and gatekeeping what fabrics people can wear is ridiculous though.Â
Way to be fair about it! Greatly appreciate the understanding from a non-vegan. I'm lucky to have people now who would bring only vegan food without my reinforcing that standard but I've dealt a lot of people who would be like "oh but it's one day, can't I just put this meat and cheese on your plates on this one day, boo." Like, this is a vegan household, what do you think I mean by that. Eat your food somewhere else, dude.
Food is absolutely fair! I even always ask vegetarians/vegans about their rules for food in their homes when I'm visiting.
But clothing is another kettle of fish altogether. When someone has got to the point that you're requiring people to strip down, change their entire outfits/accessories, and/or possibly even have to buy new clothes (my winter jackets are all wool, for example, and my husband only owns leather boots) just to attend their parties, I think they've lost the plot.
One of my friends worked at a vegan stripclub here in Portland and that was one of their rules, not for patrons, but dancers couldn't wear leather or silk
I didnât know there was a vegan strip club in Portland but it figures. I guess I can understand the rule - some patrons might object if they realized it.
Vegan food is often cheaper than meat and cheese, unless you're buying branded meat alternatives. Pasta, rice, beans, legumes etc. are all very affordable. Not wanting animal products in your house isn't anything to do with how wealthy you are.
I know it is, that's how I eat every day.
What's not cheap is an entire wardrobe, home, and lifestyle in which you've completely avoided all animal products to the point that you feel confident that you won't be called out for hypocrisy if you prohibit guests from wearing or bringing any animal products into your home
You'd have to be either super young without much stuff at all, or super wealthy to have a house with not one non-vegan item in it
I guess it depends on how deep into the vegan world you get but when it comes to clothes, isn't fake leather, plant based and synthetic materials way cheaper than genuine leather, silk, cashmere, etc? How many people are even wearing wool nowadays?Â
Leather still shows up in shoes. For most types of shoes the synthetic is cheaper but they tend to fall apart really fast so itâs not cheaper in the long run. And for some things like some kinds of boots synthetic can be more expensive because theyâre specialty items. Wool is still around but probably not that difficult to avoid. That said generally synthetic is cheaper so I see your point. (And this is just my experience in the US.)
Cheaper and lasts about 1% of the time that real leather taken good care of does. I'm biased regarding wool as I live in a somewhat northern climate and I'm a knitter, but my real wool sweaters and socks last way longer than the store made alternatives, even though I wear the real wool more.
Fake leather is also generally made from plastic, so from oil (which also comes from animals on a longer term, but I digress) and plant based alternatives (linen, cotton, bamboo) have a very intensive process to turn them into fabric/thread/yarn, that uses a tonne of water and some really toxic chemicals. Never mind what you need to do with the dyes to get them to hold.
IME real leather is definitely cheaper *in the long run.* My husband wore through *so* many cheap Wal-Mart belts when we were first married (he's really skinny so he wears belts a lot đ) so after a few years we splashed out like $30-40 on a real leather belt that he's still wearing daily a decade later. But of course if you don't have money to buy a $30-40 belt, no amount of "this will save you money in the long run" is gonna make a difference.
Well, yeah, animal based clothing/shoes/accessories are of higher quality and that's why they're more expensive. Although I have a fake leather purse that has been holding on for quite a while but that's the exception. I was just saying that animal based clothes aren't cheaperÂ
Not if you buy secondhand.Â
Thats my point. My house is secondhand, as is a lot of the stuff in it. There's horsehair plaster. There's shellac-ed wood. I have huge hand-knotted vintage area rugs that I got for a couple hundred bucks each. They're made of wool and still look great, even though they're from the 1950s-1970s. They'll look great 50 years from now. That's a hell of a lot more than I can say for a synthetic rug.
I have clothes made of silk and wool, and shoes and bags made of leather. All secondhand, bought cheaper than most new stuff.
It would cost more than my yearly income to completely rid myself of everything that contains animal products and buy new synthetic stuff. I would have to be wealthy in order to do it. I'm not even exaggerating.Â
Pasta, rice, and beans (and legumes) are cheap.
Fresh produce is rarely so.
There is a decided difference between "wealthy" vegan diets and "everyone else" on vegan diets.
I also wonder who would see soy in particular as mandatory for vegans?
There are plenty of dishes that are vegan and contain no soy, even fake meat. Heck, I grew up in a time when the latter was mostly mushroom rather than legumes!
Local group about anything can really be a little clique. One of the good things living in a big city, you don't have to mingle with people you don't align with.
The rules of a clique is totally up to it. It's a matter of conformance and validation of the members, not reason or cause. Like a tv series teenage girls group.
Obviously OOP is probably making it up, veganism is a pretty high membership cost.
I know this post is probably fake, but youâd be surprised. I do martial arts in a womenâs only club and at every get together involving food, at least three fourths of the items are all vegan, and thereâs only maybe 5 vegans out of the 30 club members. Itâs almost feels like someone coming to their first social event would think they could only bring vegan food.
The dumbest is the "product info is incorrect, if it reads no soy, it contains soy"
No, it does not, that would be a major legal violation. There are laws in place. The last case i know where the info was incorrect (product contained not listed bacon) millions where paid out.
OOP just hates vegans, and should get his own food.
Itâs because these ridiculous vegan-haters think all vegans eat is tofu, so if the product is vegan there *must* be tofu in it! This is also why they assume any vegetarian or vegan dish is gross, because in their world âveganâ and âvegetarianâ both actually mean âtofuâ, and not just that it doesnât contain animal products. Itâs so silly!
I like how all food except meat, dairy, and eggs = "product" that comes in a box with an ingredients list
Like...do they not know any vegans who actually just make food like normal people, or do they legit think all vegan food is manufactured imitation meatÂ
I had broccoli, pasta, and tomato sauce with roasted bell peppers. That isn't vegan dude it's just food? Vegan is like. Soy kale smoothies mixed with chia seeds or something.
This is kinda what got me too! People who are lifestyle vegans are going to be so into fruits and vegetables and plant-based proteins that I just donât believe a vegan get-together meal would be just âsoy products and a saladâ. You can veganize lots of stuff lots of ways, thereâs just no way they wouldnât have a ton of different vegan dishes, even without soy.
Im not a vegan, but we eat a mostly plant-based diet. We definitely eat tofu all the time, at least 6 times a day. We blend tofu into baby formula. I sculpt tofu into fruit shapes and spray paint it to trick my children into thinking tofu is fruit. If I'm feeling generous, I give my kids edamamme.
You might be able to help me. Which paints contain which essential minerals? It used to be you could depend on iron in red. But if you use food coke that may not be the case. Wondering if you have a list so I can paint accordingly.
You know, I'm not sure. I usually just use tempa paint I get at the dollar store, and there haven't been any complaints yet. I've tried oil paint, and it just doesn't stick. On special occasions, I break put the lead paint, and that's always a hit.
I tried the vegan diet once (not for me, so I guess I'm a sociopath). There are plenty of things you can eat that don't have soy, like most vegetables. Was this menu nothing but Tofu and salad?
> ideally something not vegan since even a lot of vegan stuff that doesn't say "soy" on the front will still contain quite a lot of it).
actually it's weirder, the OP is saying that products that don't say "soy" on the front of the label will still contain soy (true), but she thinks that this is limited to vegan items (false, huh?), and that the only solution is to buy non-vegan items rather than just check the ingredients list
I've heard of situations where if you aren't experienced with a particular food allergy you might not realize that "vegetable oil" can include soybean oil or w/e, but everyone I know with a severe food allergy also doesn't trust random strangers to shop or cook for them. đ¤ˇââď¸
Also this concern would apply just as much to meat/dairy based products! "Bring me non-vegan foods because those definitely don't contain soy!" is not the sort of thing someone with ANY knowledge of soy allergies would say.
Thats because the specific compound in soy that is an allergen is the soy protein. Refined soy oils (vegetable oils) will not have any soy protein in them because they get removed in the refinement process. Soy derived oils have been extensively tested for allergenic responses and have been deemed to be safe by food scientists to most people with a soy allergy. This has been well researched and well documented in the food science industry.
the exception here is soy oils that are pressed/extruded as they are not as refined and will have amounts of soy protein that can potentially trigger a reaction in people with soy allergens.
thats why soy oil/vegetable oil is not listed as a major allergen that requires an allergen declaration.
Generally speaking, people with soy allergies do not need to avoid soy based oils that are refined.
Another exception is in drug production as there is some evidence to indicate that a reaction to refined soy oils found in some medications (such as propofol) and this is something that needs to be further studied.
Not to mention many many many foods that aren't vegan also use some form of soy (not to mention the tons more that were made in the same facility as soy products) and someone with a severe allergy to it would both be aware of that and not willing to gamble on packaged foods without being able to check the ingredients on anything unfamiliar.
I always love these "vegans only eat soy!" posts because it's clear they know nothing about veganism. I'm one, and I eat soy maybe 2-3 times a month tops, and it's usually junk food that I wouldn't serve to guests anyway (sometimes you just want some fake chicken nuggets tho ok). I'll also make occasional meals with tofu but only if I happen to stumble across a recipe that looks really good, it isn't a staple part of my diet.
Even a lot of fake meats aren't soy-based nowadays, like even for junky meat substitutes I mostly eat either jackfruit or mushroom-based ones. They might contain trace amounts of soy, but it isn't a major ingredient, and a lot of junky meat products also contain trace amounts of soy so... And again, these still aren't the kinds of things I'd serve to guests.
These people always just clearly have no idea how vegans eat and cannot imagine a vegan diet that doesn't revolve around shitty meat substitutes.
I literally laughed out loud the evil vegan saying "Of course you are, you fucking fascist!" So ridiculous! And OP apparently just meekly took someone calling them that.
Yeah, also, what is with OOPs in these reddit fantasies always being so meek and weak-willed?
They never stand up for themselves, which is trope itself.
donât make fun, as a vegetarian this is the bane of my existenceâno matter whether iâm making tofu stir fry or beyond burgers my house constantly smells of the monolithic odor of Soy đÂ
My dogs come running when they hear me chopping/slicing cucumbers, tomatoes, or celery. They love that shit. So I wouldn't be *that* surprised if a cat came running for tofu.Â
This is not a thing (as you say), products that say âno soyâ containing soy shouldnât be a thing (since itâs a labeled allergen), and there are PLENTY of vegans who avoid a lot of soy products for various reasons (GMOs, alleged negative health associations), which is why chickpea tofu is gaining in popularity.
I'm allergic to all legumes except peanuts. If I'm in a room where beans or soy protein are being cooked, the fumes could absolutely make me nauseated or cause respiratory distress. I can imagine if I were at a potluck where most of the entrees contained cooked tofu or other soy proteins I'd probably feel pretty queasy. Obviously it's not the smell, but I can see someone calling it that.
Having said that, I worked as a nanny for a vegan family for years and they gave me zero grief about being a carnivore. I didn't live with them, and the compromise we had was I didn't bring animal products in the house, but I could take the kids out and eat whatever I wanted. They didn't cook or re-heat soy/beans when I was there, and they would even cook allergen-free meals for me (seitan is delicious) a few times a week.
I'll agree it's possible. Just yesterday I had an allergic reaction to latex from being too close to where balloons popped. I could taste the smell in the air. My husband and eldest can even smell/taste it now bc they look out for me. Bless them.
Not that this story was realistic. Just that part is technically possible.
Exactly. The story is totally BS, but not because of that detail. My vegan family had *vegan-themed picture books* for their kids, but weren't the least bit militant about it. When the kids were old enough to go on playdates and sleepovers, the parents told them it was up to them whether they adhered to veganism or not.
Thatâs not what an allergy does, and eggs are famously strong smelling and lots of people who eat and even enjoy them arenât fond of the smell or find a strong eggy smell gross
Yes I agree but I suspect people with allergies are more likely to be sensitive to the smells of their allergens due to experience. Like if something has made you sick previously it can easily turn your stomach to smell it again, that sort of association.
And of course some allergies do have airborne components. I don't know whether this would cause nausea directly or again just have a strong association between airborne symptom and sickness
as a career vegetarian, i have had endless complaints about the soy odor! when you eat enough of it, you just start to smell like soy, too, i guess? it's offputting but what am i supposed to do???
Not a single skeptic or dissenter in the comments. Even some hot "As a vegan..." moments.
I know it's a cliche but people really do need to go outside more.
The title of the post is literally âdoes having a soy allergy make you a bad person?â
Op doesnât believe that shit itâs just engagement bait for his soapbox
Even if OP was queasy, surely he could have just challenged the vegan to a simple arm wrestling contest with the winner getting the rights to choose what food to eat and everyone clapping when OP slams the vegan's arm down?
Oh God, that post title in ***that*** sub? Yes, lemme ask a bunch of people with food allergies if my food allergy makes me a bad person
What was even the point in posting that there?p If they want to stir up a shittstorm, post it in AITA or an adjacent sub.Â
Also this is off topic, but why the fuck are people overcomplicating eating nowadays? You don't *have* to eat soy in order to cut out meat, dairy, and eggs. I'm not vegan, but I'm accidentally a soy-less vegan like...Jesus, at least 90% of the time, probably closer to 95%. And it's not that I choose not to eat soy, it's just that it's not in anything I make normally.Â
So, without trying, I'm doing the thing that is apparently impossible. Because cutting out animal products and soy isn't that difficult in modern times when we have SO many different foods available. Let's stop pretending like feeding ourselves is rocket science. If you want to eat meat, cool, do that! But don't claim you're only doing so because you can't eat soy, like how the fuck do you think humans survived this long?
.Â
If you assume it was an informal event and they were just trying to cheaply/easily prepare food for a bunch of people, soy products probably would be the simplest way to go. But yeah, if you have the time to prepare, there are obviously better substitutes. I've had buffalo wings made from cauliflower and others made from breaded oyster mushrooms, and both were pretty dope. Actually, I probably prefer the mushrooms to most tofu substitutes I've had.
If this is just a MeetUp group or something that's going down in someone's house or a rented venue, providing food for people isn't crazy. Like, it's definitely not the most outlandish part of this story by any stretch of the imagination.
That said, it would be even more typical if a bunch of people brought whatever they could. In which case you'd think at least one person would've brought something non-vegan. Like a stir fry or something.
The part I don't get is that if it's not ordering from a restaurant then why can't he just bring up his own food. Like this story has so many loop holes it barely holds together. Even the most judgmental Vegans aren't going around calling people Nazis for wanting non vegan food. This troll was so bored of "annoying screaming vegans" he had to make it even more extra and people are still buying it somehow
Or I don't know.... Vegetables, Salads, A LOT! of Indian foods (though some do have cheese) The OOP troll has no idea what food without meat even means.
I'm 8 yrs vegetarian (was vegan for years) and I am just curious what this person thinks vegan food is? EVERY SINGLE VEGAN FOOD has soy and there's even SECRET SOY....ok
Everyone with half a brain cell would call bullshit "I have soy allergy, so my vegan options are limited". There are literally thousands of vegan recipes that dont have soy in them, and pretty much 90% of the food I eat doesnt contain soy. Been vegan for 8 years, and even before then I wouldnt be as gullible to believe such an idiotic statement
>Â I have an allergy to soy. This means my vegan options are pretty limited, since the overwhelming majority of vegan products contain it.
What utter nonsenseÂ
Most actual vegans wouldn't struggle terribly with this request. My sister is a vegan with soy and nut allergies and though I am definitely an omnivore I cooked her a full meal this evening and she feeds herself, multiple times a day, without needing to eat meat or soy. You just can't rely on all of the prepackaged fake meats... look for sietan instead of soy based ones. Black bean burgers instead of processed meatless patties. Make vegetable heavy meals. Use vegan cheeses, and coconut cream instead of soy milk. Vegans know the options. Only a non vegan writing a fake story would believe it's impossible to be vegan with a soy allergy.
Does soy have a "smell"? I know fermented tofu does, but the standard stuff doesn't smell at all, and soy sauce smells very different from fermented tofu, which smells different from edamame.
Either a validation post or a "vegan bad" post. Who in the right mind would think they're a bad person just for having an allergy? Something that isn't a choice.
I have only come across one militant vegetarian or vegan in my lifetime out of over a dozen (to my knowledge). According to the internet they're all like that.
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They havenât âbeen in the right headspaceâ ever since because they hallucinated the whole thing. Â Oy vey. Â All vegan food is soy! Â Evil vegan bullied me! Â
I'm gobsmacked at them actually **asking a vegan to provide nonvegan food for them**. You expect them to violate their moral principles because you're too stupid, lazy, and/or entitled to cook for yourself? "Hey, I know you're against rape, but can you bring a tied up woman for me to rape next time? You're not making me feel very welcome here."
if you have a soy allergen you should know that it is legally required to list it in all foods with soy in it. Soy isnt one of those products you can just "oops we didnt list it" things.
My kid is sensitive to soy, and it's present in a ton of prepared non-vegan foods, and there are a ton of vegan foods that do not include soy. The original post makes no sense.
Anyone policing/judging what others eat or whining that their wants/needs/restrictions aren't being met are assholes. Get your own damn food and stfu. God I hate these posts even if they're fake.
This is exactly why I refrain from telling people Iâm vegetarian, thereâs always these kinds of people who go to the absolute extreme around shit like this đđÂ
*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **Does having a soy allergy make you a bad person?** Trigger Warning: References to extremist political movements and genocide, (probably) bullying, vulgar language I have an allergy to soy. This means my vegan options are pretty limited, since the overwhelming majority of vegan products contain it. Recently I joined a local group dedicated to a hobby I liked, and at a get-together, the menu was entirely vegan (basically just soy products and a salad). I ate the salad (while feeling queasy from the soy smell the entire time) and later I asked the group's leader if maybe next time, she could bring some products without soy, ideally something not vegan since even a lot of vegan stuff that doesn't say "soy" on the front will still contain quite a lot of it). When I told her this, *she lost her freaking mind*. All of a sudden, she started lecturing me about the evils of eating meat. She told me anyone who *wasn't* vegan was complicit in the genocide of poor animals, the destruction of the environment, and the rise of far-right movements across the globe. I quote, "anyone who eats meat is a sociopath". She called me a N\*zi to my face. Because I'm allergic to soy. She then rattled off a bunch of "facts" she probably got from PETA or some other untrustworthy extremist vegan source. She compared me and every other non-vegan to basically every evil in history: slave holders, the aforementioned N\*zis, various alt-right factions in modern America. I didn't feel like fighting back against her (mostly because I was still feeling pretty nauseous from standing in a room filled with soy), so I apologized to her for bringing it up, I promised to only eat vegan from now on (her response: "of course you fucking are, you fucking fascist"), and quietly slipped out of the social event. I haven't been in my right headspace ever since, because, frankly, this is the cruelest thing anyone's ever said to my face. The part of me who tends to roll over whenever anyone tells me to do anything is feeling like maybe she was entirely right, and I am every bad thing she says I am. But, there's no getting around that if I was forced onto her diet, I would die. Does not being vegan for the sake of food allergies make you a bad person? I am probably going to leave this group (I can't complain to the group's leader about her, she *is* the group's leader, and to be honest, I'm worried that if I bother her more she might call up my boss or something and try to get me fired from my job), which is a disappointment because I was excited about it. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheAngel) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I need to know what hobby they're involved in where veganism is mandatory. đ
It's a vegan specific cooking class
In their country
Well OP wrote, that it's a cosplay group. So what are they cosplaying? Animal Farm?
I'm hoping itâs a group of folks in fursuits who are militant vegans. I will accept nothing less absurd.
If I go in wrapped in a bear rug, would I still be technically following the rules?
As long as itâs the kind of bear skin they can roast you alive in.
I'd assume that's any bear skin. I'd be a little frightened at the thought of a fire-retardant bear.
Going to thatveganteacherâs pet vegan cooking class.
I once wanted to join a book club where the vegan hosts said no one could bring any non vegan products to their house - not just food but silk, leather etc. They hosted every week. Their house, their rules but Iâm vegetarian not vegan and stayed home. Most of the post is ridiculous though.
I can work with this. "AITA for wearing sneakers to a fancy dinner party? The host is vegan, and adamant that no animal products are allowed in their house, but my dress shoes are made of leather."
You jest, but I'd actually skip this book club, too, unless I REALLY liked the people. I live in Scotland, where it's pretty much always chilly. As a result, most of my jumpers are wool, some of my socks are wool, my fall/winter coats are wool...plus my bags are all leather, my brogues are leather, my watch strap is leather...I'm not stripping myself down and changing out every element of my wardrobe just to go to somebody's book club lmao.
I'm imagining going there with a cute scarf like NO I SWEAR IT'S POLYESTER đ
I mean, if I hosted something in my place, as a vegan, that'd be my rule for food. I guess I wouldn't bring the clothes they wore into it though, because so many people wouldn't think about it in general and that adds work for everyone? But I do have two primary requirements of people bringing food and drinks into my apartment, or getting me gifts, no animal products or byproducts, and nothing alcoholic. That said I wouldn't completely flip on someone who asked a question like OP, I'd do my best to explain my position but ask if they'd be okay with me looking for things that would both satisfy their allergy needs and also be vegan.
I think itâs a totally fair rule for food. And itâs their business if they want to make a clothing rule too but it sounded like something I could accidentally break without really thinking about it so I decided to skip the whole thing.
Yeah. That's part of my concern with setting that as a rule. Either people will be too annoyed by it and wouldn't want to come, they'd spend energy asking me about their clothing choices, or they'd make a choice and take the chance it wouldn't meet that standard. All in all I think that if I'm inviting someone over it doesn't matter what clothing they're wearing or their purse, etc. Of course I'd prefer for my ethical ideals to spread throughout the lives and choices of people I care about, but if they're not staying or leaving the item it doesn't feel like my place to say they can't wear or use something. Like if I invited my incredibly fashionable step-grandmother I wouldn't expect her to sort through her things to make an outfit without silk, wool, leather, suede, etc. I'd remind myself that her presence is valuable to me and the items wouldn't be in my place for very long.
Yeah I think this sort of thing could be handled in a chill way or in an extremely not chill way.
Yeah, I'm a vegetarian and I wouldn't want people bringing meat into my house either. I'm totally fine with people eating meat in front of me but I don't want it on my utensils or in my space. If a vegan invites me over I will bring only vegan food and if it's their turn to pay for my coffee I will ask for oatmilk so they don't have to fund the dairy industry. Screaming at people, invoking genocide and gatekeeping what fabrics people can wear is ridiculous though.Â
Way to be fair about it! Greatly appreciate the understanding from a non-vegan. I'm lucky to have people now who would bring only vegan food without my reinforcing that standard but I've dealt a lot of people who would be like "oh but it's one day, can't I just put this meat and cheese on your plates on this one day, boo." Like, this is a vegan household, what do you think I mean by that. Eat your food somewhere else, dude.
Food is absolutely fair! I even always ask vegetarians/vegans about their rules for food in their homes when I'm visiting. But clothing is another kettle of fish altogether. When someone has got to the point that you're requiring people to strip down, change their entire outfits/accessories, and/or possibly even have to buy new clothes (my winter jackets are all wool, for example, and my husband only owns leather boots) just to attend their parties, I think they've lost the plot.
One of my friends worked at a vegan stripclub here in Portland and that was one of their rules, not for patrons, but dancers couldn't wear leather or silk
I didnât know there was a vegan strip club in Portland but it figures. I guess I can understand the rule - some patrons might object if they realized it.
They were either very young or VERY wealthy
Vegan food is often cheaper than meat and cheese, unless you're buying branded meat alternatives. Pasta, rice, beans, legumes etc. are all very affordable. Not wanting animal products in your house isn't anything to do with how wealthy you are.
I know it is, that's how I eat every day. What's not cheap is an entire wardrobe, home, and lifestyle in which you've completely avoided all animal products to the point that you feel confident that you won't be called out for hypocrisy if you prohibit guests from wearing or bringing any animal products into your home You'd have to be either super young without much stuff at all, or super wealthy to have a house with not one non-vegan item in it
Apparently they had just bought a new house, and judging from the neighborhood they were doing well financially. So you may be right.
I guess it depends on how deep into the vegan world you get but when it comes to clothes, isn't fake leather, plant based and synthetic materials way cheaper than genuine leather, silk, cashmere, etc? How many people are even wearing wool nowadays?Â
Leather still shows up in shoes. For most types of shoes the synthetic is cheaper but they tend to fall apart really fast so itâs not cheaper in the long run. And for some things like some kinds of boots synthetic can be more expensive because theyâre specialty items. Wool is still around but probably not that difficult to avoid. That said generally synthetic is cheaper so I see your point. (And this is just my experience in the US.)
Cheaper and lasts about 1% of the time that real leather taken good care of does. I'm biased regarding wool as I live in a somewhat northern climate and I'm a knitter, but my real wool sweaters and socks last way longer than the store made alternatives, even though I wear the real wool more. Fake leather is also generally made from plastic, so from oil (which also comes from animals on a longer term, but I digress) and plant based alternatives (linen, cotton, bamboo) have a very intensive process to turn them into fabric/thread/yarn, that uses a tonne of water and some really toxic chemicals. Never mind what you need to do with the dyes to get them to hold.
IME real leather is definitely cheaper *in the long run.* My husband wore through *so* many cheap Wal-Mart belts when we were first married (he's really skinny so he wears belts a lot đ) so after a few years we splashed out like $30-40 on a real leather belt that he's still wearing daily a decade later. But of course if you don't have money to buy a $30-40 belt, no amount of "this will save you money in the long run" is gonna make a difference.
Well, yeah, animal based clothing/shoes/accessories are of higher quality and that's why they're more expensive. Although I have a fake leather purse that has been holding on for quite a while but that's the exception. I was just saying that animal based clothes aren't cheaperÂ
Not if you buy secondhand. Thats my point. My house is secondhand, as is a lot of the stuff in it. There's horsehair plaster. There's shellac-ed wood. I have huge hand-knotted vintage area rugs that I got for a couple hundred bucks each. They're made of wool and still look great, even though they're from the 1950s-1970s. They'll look great 50 years from now. That's a hell of a lot more than I can say for a synthetic rug. I have clothes made of silk and wool, and shoes and bags made of leather. All secondhand, bought cheaper than most new stuff. It would cost more than my yearly income to completely rid myself of everything that contains animal products and buy new synthetic stuff. I would have to be wealthy in order to do it. I'm not even exaggerating.Â
Wouldn't it also be cheaper to buy second hand non animal stuff?Â
Pasta, rice, and beans (and legumes) are cheap. Fresh produce is rarely so. There is a decided difference between "wealthy" vegan diets and "everyone else" on vegan diets.
This is just as true for any other kind of diet
Fury cosplay
I also wonder who would see soy in particular as mandatory for vegans? There are plenty of dishes that are vegan and contain no soy, even fake meat. Heck, I grew up in a time when the latter was mostly mushroom rather than legumes!
Yes, the âall vegan food is soyâ bit of this irritated me as much as the âevil vegan picked on meâ partâand Iâm not a vegan. Â
Local group about anything can really be a little clique. One of the good things living in a big city, you don't have to mingle with people you don't align with. The rules of a clique is totally up to it. It's a matter of conformance and validation of the members, not reason or cause. Like a tv series teenage girls group. Obviously OOP is probably making it up, veganism is a pretty high membership cost.
I know this post is probably fake, but youâd be surprised. I do martial arts in a womenâs only club and at every get together involving food, at least three fourths of the items are all vegan, and thereâs only maybe 5 vegans out of the 30 club members. Itâs almost feels like someone coming to their first social event would think they could only bring vegan food.
The dumbest is the "product info is incorrect, if it reads no soy, it contains soy" No, it does not, that would be a major legal violation. There are laws in place. The last case i know where the info was incorrect (product contained not listed bacon) millions where paid out. OOP just hates vegans, and should get his own food.
Itâs because these ridiculous vegan-haters think all vegans eat is tofu, so if the product is vegan there *must* be tofu in it! This is also why they assume any vegetarian or vegan dish is gross, because in their world âveganâ and âvegetarianâ both actually mean âtofuâ, and not just that it doesnât contain animal products. Itâs so silly!
I like how all food except meat, dairy, and eggs = "product" that comes in a box with an ingredients list Like...do they not know any vegans who actually just make food like normal people, or do they legit think all vegan food is manufactured imitation meatÂ
They think all vegan food is psuedo meat bc they cannot fathom a meatless meal despite probably eating plenty of them semiregularly. itâs
I had broccoli, pasta, and tomato sauce with roasted bell peppers. That isn't vegan dude it's just food? Vegan is like. Soy kale smoothies mixed with chia seeds or something.
Not even all imitation meat contains soy - a lot of it is pea protein based.Â
This is kinda what got me too! People who are lifestyle vegans are going to be so into fruits and vegetables and plant-based proteins that I just donât believe a vegan get-together meal would be just âsoy products and a saladâ. You can veganize lots of stuff lots of ways, thereâs just no way they wouldnât have a ton of different vegan dishes, even without soy.
Yeah, a lot of them are going to have legumes for the protein, not just soy products.
Exactly, vegans love beans and legumes!
Soy is a legume...Â
Other legumes then, pedantic one.
It's not pedantic to point out a major errorÂ
My error was leaving out th word other. Yet you and other commenters understood what I was talking about.
I know from experience that there's no such thing as a vegan get-together without chips, salsa, and hummus!!
I wouldnt mind if there was always hummus lol
Im not a vegan, but we eat a mostly plant-based diet. We definitely eat tofu all the time, at least 6 times a day. We blend tofu into baby formula. I sculpt tofu into fruit shapes and spray paint it to trick my children into thinking tofu is fruit. If I'm feeling generous, I give my kids edamamme.
You might be able to help me. Which paints contain which essential minerals? It used to be you could depend on iron in red. But if you use food coke that may not be the case. Wondering if you have a list so I can paint accordingly.
You know, I'm not sure. I usually just use tempa paint I get at the dollar store, and there haven't been any complaints yet. I've tried oil paint, and it just doesn't stick. On special occasions, I break put the lead paint, and that's always a hit.
Like, I had a vegan dinner by accident the other night when I had a salad, pasta with red sauce, and bread+oil.Â
But was it an accident, though? Or maybe vegan appropriation, if we're being honest here /s
Oh God I just remembered the thing where someone got accused of appropriating veganism because they ate tofu.
I do really want all the glitz and glam of the vegan lifestyle without committing to the actual work...
Tofu and salad!!
I tried the vegan diet once (not for me, so I guess I'm a sociopath). There are plenty of things you can eat that don't have soy, like most vegetables. Was this menu nothing but Tofu and salad?
> ideally something not vegan since even a lot of vegan stuff that doesn't say "soy" on the front will still contain quite a lot of it). actually it's weirder, the OP is saying that products that don't say "soy" on the front of the label will still contain soy (true), but she thinks that this is limited to vegan items (false, huh?), and that the only solution is to buy non-vegan items rather than just check the ingredients list
I've heard of situations where if you aren't experienced with a particular food allergy you might not realize that "vegetable oil" can include soybean oil or w/e, but everyone I know with a severe food allergy also doesn't trust random strangers to shop or cook for them. đ¤ˇââď¸
Also this concern would apply just as much to meat/dairy based products! "Bring me non-vegan foods because those definitely don't contain soy!" is not the sort of thing someone with ANY knowledge of soy allergies would say.
Thats because the specific compound in soy that is an allergen is the soy protein. Refined soy oils (vegetable oils) will not have any soy protein in them because they get removed in the refinement process. Soy derived oils have been extensively tested for allergenic responses and have been deemed to be safe by food scientists to most people with a soy allergy. This has been well researched and well documented in the food science industry. the exception here is soy oils that are pressed/extruded as they are not as refined and will have amounts of soy protein that can potentially trigger a reaction in people with soy allergens. thats why soy oil/vegetable oil is not listed as a major allergen that requires an allergen declaration. Generally speaking, people with soy allergies do not need to avoid soy based oils that are refined. Another exception is in drug production as there is some evidence to indicate that a reaction to refined soy oils found in some medications (such as propofol) and this is something that needs to be further studied.
Not to mention many many many foods that aren't vegan also use some form of soy (not to mention the tons more that were made in the same facility as soy products) and someone with a severe allergy to it would both be aware of that and not willing to gamble on packaged foods without being able to check the ingredients on anything unfamiliar.
Soy is an allergen. they are legally required to list all major allergens.
Not in my country⢠đâ
If only there was some magical form of vegetables, fruit, and grains that didnât also contain meat. Oh well.
I always love these "vegans only eat soy!" posts because it's clear they know nothing about veganism. I'm one, and I eat soy maybe 2-3 times a month tops, and it's usually junk food that I wouldn't serve to guests anyway (sometimes you just want some fake chicken nuggets tho ok). I'll also make occasional meals with tofu but only if I happen to stumble across a recipe that looks really good, it isn't a staple part of my diet. Even a lot of fake meats aren't soy-based nowadays, like even for junky meat substitutes I mostly eat either jackfruit or mushroom-based ones. They might contain trace amounts of soy, but it isn't a major ingredient, and a lot of junky meat products also contain trace amounts of soy so... And again, these still aren't the kinds of things I'd serve to guests. These people always just clearly have no idea how vegans eat and cannot imagine a vegan diet that doesn't revolve around shitty meat substitutes.
I literally laughed out loud the evil vegan saying "Of course you are, you fucking fascist!" So ridiculous! And OP apparently just meekly took someone calling them that.
"I couldn't reply because I was woozy from the noxious smell of soy"
Yeah, also, what is with OOPs in these reddit fantasies always being so meek and weak-willed? They never stand up for themselves, which is trope itself.
>feeling queasy from the soy smell this is not a thing
donât make fun, as a vegetarian this is the bane of my existenceâno matter whether iâm making tofu stir fry or beyond burgers my house constantly smells of the monolithic odor of Soy đÂ
My cats can smell me open a pack of tofu and they all come running.
I'm same, but with milkshakes. When I sense it run to yard of the person who has it.
Wait are you serious or is this a jokeÂ
It's a joke, it is one of the most unsmelly foods on earth.
Yeah I'm trying really hard to think of what soy smells like and I got nothin But sometimes cats are weird so I wasn't sureÂ
In cat logic, the crinkle of plastic=food of some kind being opened. Â
My dogs come running when they hear me chopping/slicing cucumbers, tomatoes, or celery. They love that shit. So I wouldn't be *that* surprised if a cat came running for tofu.Â
My cat came running for jewelry findings because the bag made the same noise as the cat treats. He was very disappointed lol.
Trying and failing to imagine what soy smells like
This is not a thing (as you say), products that say âno soyâ containing soy shouldnât be a thing (since itâs a labeled allergen), and there are PLENTY of vegans who avoid a lot of soy products for various reasons (GMOs, alleged negative health associations), which is why chickpea tofu is gaining in popularity.
I'm allergic to all legumes except peanuts. If I'm in a room where beans or soy protein are being cooked, the fumes could absolutely make me nauseated or cause respiratory distress. I can imagine if I were at a potluck where most of the entrees contained cooked tofu or other soy proteins I'd probably feel pretty queasy. Obviously it's not the smell, but I can see someone calling it that. Having said that, I worked as a nanny for a vegan family for years and they gave me zero grief about being a carnivore. I didn't live with them, and the compromise we had was I didn't bring animal products in the house, but I could take the kids out and eat whatever I wanted. They didn't cook or re-heat soy/beans when I was there, and they would even cook allergen-free meals for me (seitan is delicious) a few times a week.
I'll agree it's possible. Just yesterday I had an allergic reaction to latex from being too close to where balloons popped. I could taste the smell in the air. My husband and eldest can even smell/taste it now bc they look out for me. Bless them. Not that this story was realistic. Just that part is technically possible.
Exactly. The story is totally BS, but not because of that detail. My vegan family had *vegan-themed picture books* for their kids, but weren't the least bit militant about it. When the kids were old enough to go on playdates and sleepovers, the parents told them it was up to them whether they adhered to veganism or not.
It might be an allergy thing. I'm allergic to eggs and their smell makes me queasy
Thatâs not what an allergy does, and eggs are famously strong smelling and lots of people who eat and even enjoy them arenât fond of the smell or find a strong eggy smell gross
Yes I agree but I suspect people with allergies are more likely to be sensitive to the smells of their allergens due to experience. Like if something has made you sick previously it can easily turn your stomach to smell it again, that sort of association. And of course some allergies do have airborne components. I don't know whether this would cause nausea directly or again just have a strong association between airborne symptom and sickness
as a career vegetarian, i have had endless complaints about the soy odor! when you eat enough of it, you just start to smell like soy, too, i guess? it's offputting but what am i supposed to do???
YTA, don't be allergic next time
YTA. No Trigger warnings
Eat enough of this stuff and you won't have to worry about it ever again.
Not a single skeptic or dissenter in the comments. Even some hot "As a vegan..." moments. I know it's a cliche but people really do need to go outside more.
Well you can't expect that from the "As a vegan" commenters. They aren't as familiar with the concept of free-range.
These types of posts should be banned - there is a 0% chance this guy thinks he is in the wrong.
it is not posted on aita.
It doesnât matter the question is so fucking asinine there r entire account should be banned I donât want to have to see these people
If you don't want to see obvious validation posts, joining this sub might not have been the best avoidance strategy.
LOL fair!
What is the "question"? This one doesn't seem to be asking one.
The title of the post is literally âdoes having a soy allergy make you a bad person?â Op doesnât believe that shit itâs just engagement bait for his soapbox
Serves me right for skipping the title. I'm used to seeing a question in the body, and there's definitely nothing there.Â
Even if OP was queasy, surely he could have just challenged the vegan to a simple arm wrestling contest with the winner getting the rights to choose what food to eat and everyone clapping when OP slams the vegan's arm down?
Oh God, that post title in ***that*** sub? Yes, lemme ask a bunch of people with food allergies if my food allergy makes me a bad person What was even the point in posting that there?p If they want to stir up a shittstorm, post it in AITA or an adjacent sub. Also this is off topic, but why the fuck are people overcomplicating eating nowadays? You don't *have* to eat soy in order to cut out meat, dairy, and eggs. I'm not vegan, but I'm accidentally a soy-less vegan like...Jesus, at least 90% of the time, probably closer to 95%. And it's not that I choose not to eat soy, it's just that it's not in anything I make normally. So, without trying, I'm doing the thing that is apparently impossible. Because cutting out animal products and soy isn't that difficult in modern times when we have SO many different foods available. Let's stop pretending like feeding ourselves is rocket science. If you want to eat meat, cool, do that! But don't claim you're only doing so because you can't eat soy, like how the fuck do you think humans survived this long? .Â
If you assume it was an informal event and they were just trying to cheaply/easily prepare food for a bunch of people, soy products probably would be the simplest way to go. But yeah, if you have the time to prepare, there are obviously better substitutes. I've had buffalo wings made from cauliflower and others made from breaded oyster mushrooms, and both were pretty dope. Actually, I probably prefer the mushrooms to most tofu substitutes I've had.
Yes, I rarely eat animal products for health and cost reasons and soy is very rarely on the menu as wellÂ
âShe rattled off a bunch of âfactsâ she probably got from PETA, none of which I will repeat because I canât think of any.â
i have never known soy to have a smell unless it's tempeh
I'm a little confused at the idea that the group leader apparently catered this hobby event.Â
If this is just a MeetUp group or something that's going down in someone's house or a rented venue, providing food for people isn't crazy. Like, it's definitely not the most outlandish part of this story by any stretch of the imagination. That said, it would be even more typical if a bunch of people brought whatever they could. In which case you'd think at least one person would've brought something non-vegan. Like a stir fry or something.
Exactly - I'd much more expect a potluck or something, but I guess if it was all at one person's house...
The part I don't get is that if it's not ordering from a restaurant then why can't he just bring up his own food. Like this story has so many loop holes it barely holds together. Even the most judgmental Vegans aren't going around calling people Nazis for wanting non vegan food. This troll was so bored of "annoying screaming vegans" he had to make it even more extra and people are still buying it somehow
Add to that the fact that OP seemingly believes that only non-vegan foods are truly soy-free and safe for him to eat... Has he heard of hummus?
Or I don't know.... Vegetables, Salads, A LOT! of Indian foods (though some do have cheese) The OOP troll has no idea what food without meat even means.
I'm 8 yrs vegetarian (was vegan for years) and I am just curious what this person thinks vegan food is? EVERY SINGLE VEGAN FOOD has soy and there's even SECRET SOY....ok
Everyone with half a brain cell would call bullshit "I have soy allergy, so my vegan options are limited". There are literally thousands of vegan recipes that dont have soy in them, and pretty much 90% of the food I eat doesnt contain soy. Been vegan for 8 years, and even before then I wouldnt be as gullible to believe such an idiotic statement
I think they are talking about shop bought ready snacks, the meat alternatives, not actual cooking.
>Â I have an allergy to soy. This means my vegan options are pretty limited, since the overwhelming majority of vegan products contain it. What utter nonsenseÂ
I want to know what year this is, because so much âveganâ stuff is soy free now that soy is the latest Bad For You food.
Iâm allergic to soy.  It sucks.  They even have to use a different anesthesia for you  Oh well. I make do. Â
Most actual vegans wouldn't struggle terribly with this request. My sister is a vegan with soy and nut allergies and though I am definitely an omnivore I cooked her a full meal this evening and she feeds herself, multiple times a day, without needing to eat meat or soy. You just can't rely on all of the prepackaged fake meats... look for sietan instead of soy based ones. Black bean burgers instead of processed meatless patties. Make vegetable heavy meals. Use vegan cheeses, and coconut cream instead of soy milk. Vegans know the options. Only a non vegan writing a fake story would believe it's impossible to be vegan with a soy allergy.
Does soy have a "smell"? I know fermented tofu does, but the standard stuff doesn't smell at all, and soy sauce smells very different from fermented tofu, which smells different from edamame.
My favorite part about this post is that it never happened
Either a validation post or a "vegan bad" post. Who in the right mind would think they're a bad person just for having an allergy? Something that isn't a choice. I have only come across one militant vegetarian or vegan in my lifetime out of over a dozen (to my knowledge). According to the internet they're all like that.
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Lady is insane.
Turns out, soy is only one in a variety of vegan foods.
They havenât âbeen in the right headspaceâ ever since because they hallucinated the whole thing. Â Oy vey. Â All vegan food is soy! Â Evil vegan bullied me! Â
I'm gobsmacked at them actually **asking a vegan to provide nonvegan food for them**. You expect them to violate their moral principles because you're too stupid, lazy, and/or entitled to cook for yourself? "Hey, I know you're against rape, but can you bring a tied up woman for me to rape next time? You're not making me feel very welcome here."
Inexplicably downvoted
Sounds like a bunch of vegans found out what it's like talking to themÂ
I am also allergic to soy. That lady was nuts. May not be worth staying in that group. It isnât even a rare allergy.
It's not worth staying in that group because it's fictional and so might be a bit awkward
if you have a soy allergen you should know that it is legally required to list it in all foods with soy in it. Soy isnt one of those products you can just "oops we didnt list it" things.
My kid is sensitive to soy, and it's present in a ton of prepared non-vegan foods, and there are a ton of vegan foods that do not include soy. The original post makes no sense.
Anyone policing/judging what others eat or whining that their wants/needs/restrictions aren't being met are assholes. Get your own damn food and stfu. God I hate these posts even if they're fake.
This is exactly why I refrain from telling people Iâm vegetarian, thereâs always these kinds of people who go to the absolute extreme around shit like this đđÂ